Marc M
Director Social Media & Search Engine Marketing @ Digital Response Marketing Grp. & Co-founder of Hashtagsocialmedia.com
In social media, what camp are you in? ROI or Engagement? and why?
Good Answers (11)
Emery J
at Bright House Networks
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You can't separate ROI and engagement. If you have no way to engage a user so the user returns frequently, there is no way for that user to invest time in the site.
Without engagement of some kind, there will be no ROI to measure.
Well, I think, as a user perspective, I'm in for both. I do it for fun, but it is in my mind that I can have some ROI (FI learning to know other people in the field, getting help with problems using these Answers, or Twitter)
As from a business perspective, I think it's most likely ROI, but for instance blogging can add a "fun and nice" image to your company.
So, business or pleasure, a little from both, I guess...
Mirek P
e-Strategist, e-Consultant; owner @ OPEN4net [LION: mpolyniakATgmail.com] pharma focus!
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My social media metrics is 'engagement' as this shows in a much better way how much your customers deal with your brand
It is good to measure ROI but social media gives a few more angles of brand exposure/benefits than traditional media
Dear Marc,
Regardless of whether you are considering social media or any other 'investment' there will always be problems with ROI (or any other 'return on...') measure. all of those measures are very short term and the return figure is too easy to corrupt.
So, for a business, although it is much harder to calculate, but much more effective, use net present value - which will allow for a stream of returns into the future and recognise that the further out the return the less value it has in today's terms.
It might be that someone engages with your group and tells a friend who tells a friend - impossible to measure (with any certainty) the return but easier to measure the effect on what has been described as the referral market.
However, personally, I believe Emery is correct - you cannot separate engagement from the reward side of the project regardless of how you measure that return.
For me LinkedIn Q&A is a resource in that I can use for research but also I can use to stretch my brain when I see a question posed by someone else that I have to think about to answer.
But, since I firmly beleive that 'we are those we have met' - the more people I network with and 'talk' to the more I will learn and the more rounded person I am likely to become - so the engagmernt is there as well.
Thanks for maknig me think!
Hope that helps you, even if only a little.
Regards
Neil
Craig F
13 years experience in SEO and Social Media.
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it is always both. the only way you can't be after roi in some form is if you have no business interest at all, but even then you could argue the roi you'd be after is how many people you can engage :)
I agree with both Niki and Emery in that I don't think ROI and Engagement are mutually exclusive. Really, the more compelling question would be how do you use social media? Do you use it for personal socializing? for marketing? for professional development? for networking? all of the above? In any case, ROI can only be evaluated in context to the purpose for which social media is being used. I just posted a blog post on how I think that the root of engagement is not social media in and of itself, but actual content. The social media becomes the "connector" between the individual and the content; it's not an end but a means.
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I agree that ROI and engagement can both exist but I think that engagement is what you should go for first. Bloggers are very good at spotting scammers or spammers or those who are out to make money quickly. Engagement is also why I enjoy twitter and the folks I have met on there.
Scott B
Polymath
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ROI is not just relegated to business. Part of my investment of time in Social Media is that I gain something emotionally or intellectually valuable and that I further my growth. Happy to sell a few books or pieces of art, or gain a few connections to my company's industry, but that isn't the only ROI for me. The two are connected for me.
Scott
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In my opinion, it is difficult to measure and obtain a true metric on return on investment for social media ventures.
My major focus in social media marketing is to build brand awareness with the company by using social media networks to its advantage. Unless the company is selling a desirable product, it tends to be unrealistic to expect a return on investment from social media marketing due to the nature of the medium.
Stevie W
CMO with entrepreneurial spirit & signficant social media expertise
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I am so with Niki on this and even looking beyond the ROI and Engagements.
1) ROI is the endgame result-- because you want something to happen -- hopefully in terms of awareness and also at the cash register
2) Engagements are great because it does increase awareness and the likelihood of ROI is great the more often the user is engaged.
3) Virality is critical here-- the farther out that you can push the reach, the better. It needs to hit forums, sites, blogs, twitter, and every social aggregator possible out there. WHY? Because you need to reach people where they are. They won't find you. It's more than just facebook and myspace or linkedin (a lot of people are afraid of linkedin)
By taking the viral path and stretching it out -- and having people working on that -- private forums, sites that are known for specific content, then you can get more engagements and greater ROI - provided it's crafted correctly.
4) other people who have great comments here include Richard & Jeffrey
I would go into more depth but then I would run out of character allotment (again) because this is what I do every single day and the results are always amazing for my clients. They are pleased with the results and it means more visibility, more stores, more $$$ at the register.
Clarification added August 25, 2008:
From my *marketing" perspective, if there are no engagements ( a la a print ad that you read vs skipping it) then you won’t have any ROI-- no knowledge/interest/taking action on the viewer/consumer's part.
Obviously I see ROI/engagement pretty much inexorably tied, I do realize that thare are situations, campaigns that wouldn't need engagement to get an ROI -- depeneding on what outcomes are expected to be generated. The expected outcomes absolutely determine if the ROI and engagements can be mutually exclusive or have some sort of link.
I would think that a "sit down" discussion would be able to generate some awareness on both sides about the possiblities. However if you are asking me for a concrete demonstration of ROI exclusivity, I can't think of one * unless* the consumer is already decided to do action X (buy a washing machine, get a new car, buy a window shade, pick up a prescription), there might not be much engagement involved -- except on the nature of price -- if all things including options/side effects/function are the same. That would be the case of ROI without engagement.
Druhin D
at McKesson
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ROI for social media is still in its dark age as even bigger players in this space are finding hard to generate revenues. Hence, either you do this just for fun or for engagement. If you are expecting returns, then you can forget it.
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Richard T
Founder, at KNOWLEDGE EPITOME: Corporate Training, Research & Learning Events, Personal Coaching
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I have to admit Jeffreys is 200% correct. The choice is silly and makes no sense at all--it is a very American type of choice--short term versus value, profits versus contribution to society. Only anglo cultures see that as a choice--other cultures tend to see that as a form of mental illness. The only choice for all businesses all the time is adding value to the lives of other people--THAT is the basis of profit and growth and all the rest. Psychopaths, which recent British research shows, are preferred in top manager ranks in anglo cultures, see other people only as tools of their own goals--THAT is mental illness and to hear it talked about as a "choice" or as a style of "managing" in America and other anglo cultures, really makes one wonder about the sanity of commonsense in some cultures. I am not trying to rain on anyone's parade but putting forth as a choice something like happiness or death, as if that were any sort of real choice reveals some foggy thinking and deep culture-caused delusion going on in my book.
What is the ROI on my best friends? You see, questions like that are themselves evidence of sickness. When millions in MBA programs are taught to think like that you have failing nations, like the US today and tomorrow and the US's wonderful Georgia strategy--error, error, error, error, madness.
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FRANK F
—►CEO @ Start-ups + Turnarounds —►Global Strategies + Future Trends Keynotes + Innovation Seminars
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Hello Marc:
I note you asked this under "Blogging" which I will address at the end. To begin, I see engagement and ROI as symbiotic. But let me answer from the viewpoint of a user and a business.
(1) User Perspective
As a user of social media platforms, I invest time to become engaged with interesting/intelligent people, on what hopefully will prove worthwhile. Whether there is a payback, and over what time period, is impossible to know, as with any effort to reach out.
But ROI is not primarily in my mind. Yes, I answer questions here in order to share and demonstrate what I think I know, hoping that over the long-term that might "pull" some people into mutually rewarding collaborative projects. That is clearly preferable to trying to "push" oneself onto people (it being an obsolete strategy for the social media environment).
Some refer to this as "paying forward" which I find an obscure term. You're still expending time/effort, hoping something worthwhile comes of it. I think we all need to be honest with ourselves, and each other, and admit that.
As well, of course, there are obvious intangible rewards of simply learning from others, and in making real friendships -- which don't have to evolve into ventures.
(2) Business Perspective
Any business, for sure, is getting involved in social media for tangible ROI, as well as intangible benefits. Otherwise, why do it?!
But that can only be accomplished by making a significant investment of human, technical, and monetary resources in order to engage current and future customers/users, by drawing them to your business and its products/services. That can only be accomplished by engaging them in a "conversation".
The future of social media marketing is consumer conversations, through meaningful interactions, that lead to meaningful transactions, on which the company earns a profit. As well, this engagement process will have intangible benefits, building goodwill and brand loyalty.
How one actually measures ROI in this still-evolving and immature social media marketing environment is tough to determine. But I absolutely guarantee that it will achieve far greater returns than by wasteful "push" advertising in old media.
Facebook, for example, is rolling out a new interface, about which many users are complaining. This moves the platform from an easy-to-use single-page user set-up, to a multi-page set-up which is not user friendly. They are clearly doing this for only one purpose: to free up lots of white space, in which to place display colorful advertising.
The platform badly needs to earn revenue, but any company which invests in advertising on such a "mass-membership" platform is simply wasting their money, as with any old-media "mass" advertising. And this is a challenge for all social media platforms. As "mass" platforms in a multimedia 1:1 world, they are destined to fail. They will either learn to segment their users into niches, or they will implode, as with old media.
So any business has to be careful where, when, how it considers engaging its customers/users in the social (multi)media realm. Otherwise it will achieve zero ROI, and no intangible returns either. In fact, such investments could backfire completely, with negative branding effects.
(3) Blogging (personal or business)
Much of the above similarly applies to Blogs, which are primarily a means of presenting content in an engaging way. You provide a platform or channel through which consumers/users can comment and discuss what you and they are saying. The aim is to be a "conversation" hub.
While there can be links back to a website, the aim should not be to generate sales, but to build goodwill and brand equity, which may or may not translate into sales. So again, measuring ROI is difficult. But the advantage is the ability to have users register, and to track their transactions precisely, on a 1:1 basis. Then you can track ROI by customer.
Cheers! Frank
