Steven B.
Senior Financial and Business Professional, Board Member & Devoted Father
The Ultimate Status Symbol? Multiple kids!
The Ultimate Status Symbol? Multiple kids!
Yesterday, I was on the train to New York City, and happened to have a copy of September issue of Details Magazine. There, on page 194, I read a short yet very interesting article about fatherhood (both past and present) and its correlation to financial, physical and moral superiority. To sum up the article to those who haven’t read it, or aren’t interested in spending 5 minutes reading this piece, the article points out that those fathers who ultimately have multiple kids (more than 2!) are proving their power and wealth. Question to the Linkedin Community: Do you agree with the article? What have you experienced with such a phenomena? And if you want to answer: how many kids do you have, and what do you do to raise and make “the most” of your {multiple} children?
Direct link to article:
http://men.style.com/details/features/full?id=content_5793
Have a good week everybody,
- Steven Burda, Open Networker
burda.mba@gmail.com
Answers (134)
I have 5 kids. You have to be strong to handle a family that big. My wife is pretty strong... :p
Roberta Z.
Export & Trade Finance Manager at Natixis
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Dear Steven,
I'm one of those who have not read the article, even if you kindly posted the link, but I can try an Italian answer:
If you have multiple kids (>2) in Italy (especially in cities / big towns), you're for sure proving that you have a good earning and your own parking place!
Roberta
Wow - interesting article; interesting new take on what was once considered a "bad choice" that poor Irish-Catholics did (like my family). I had never thought of my (almost) 5 children as a "status symbol", especially when I pull my 1999 Toyota Corolla into the corporate parking lot and wave hello to my peers and associates as they pop out of their Lexus or Audio or, heck, even their 2007 Hyundai!
Now I feel SO much better.
I have two children and one on the way. You have to have a support network (strong wife etc.). I do everything I can to see they succeed. Spend as much time with them now while they are young to develop the skills they will need later on in life. And yes, I have sacrificed a lot to do this.
My third child is now 8 weeks old. Having the third makes me organize my time and resources better than I did with "only" 2.
Its more of a change than I expected.
I think it depends on the culture. In the United States it usually means that a person is religious and/or wealthy. I have seen in other countries where a family has lots of children amidst poverty. In some third-world countries, the wealthier person has less children than the poorer families, because the purpose is more to have lots of children to take care of you when you're older.
I believe that children are a blessing and to have many is a blessing, but there needs to be some planning.
read, Sidney Poitier's "The Measure of a Man" in which he states the measure of a man is how he takes care of his children --
Links:
As a father of 1, I must be well on my way to "proving my power and wealth" :)
Seriously though, I think your last question is most relevant, as my experience growing up on the North Shore of Chicago and now on the Monterey Bay is that there are far too many fathers in the world with multiple children who spend little/no time with their family due to both the perceived and actual financial commitment in raising such a large family.
Different strokes for different folks though, as I have many friends and associates who want nothing to do with children and view having a "family" as a burden to their lifestyle. Though this is an ideology I don't subscribe to, I realize they simply grew up with a different perception on what family is and means.
Personally, I look to those men who have been able to architect their lives such that they both work hard and provide value to the world AND are able to spend quality and meaningful time raising their children with their wives as figures I hope to learn from and emulate.
I saw a similar article in a British newspaper back in June. I even took the paper home to show my wife since we have 4 kids and almost noone else we know does. It made us feel good.
I guess in richer countries it signals one of two things: either you are well-off or religious. And with the current trend as far as religiousness in richer countries I'd think most people with multiple kids are better off financially indeed.
You cant borrow children. Being debt free is not a status. Its good, but not a status. Status in the most part is something that can be seen.
Janette C.
Marketing Manager Membership Services
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Steven,
Hi, I don't believe mutiple kids are the ultimate Status simple. Perhaps I am setting my sights low but my idea of an Ultimate Status Symbol would probably be a Mercedes Maclaren SLR. However, on a serious notes for some cultures Children are their parents future wealth and security, the more they have the more the family's earning potential and ability to build on what their parents started grows and the greater the likelihood of future financial security. In these cultures the success of the children is the status symbol e.g. First mother: my son is a Doctor. Second Mother: My son is a Consultant. In some cultures a sign of great status is not having any kids i.e. you are so successful and important you don't have time for kids.
I only have one child and have no intention of having more. To make 'the most' of my precious one, I try to ensure he has a safe secure home life with loving parents who allow him to learn and develop and ensure he understands the importance of education and the choices and advantages that are available by ensuring that he has a good education. I think the best thing I can do is strive to ensure he has the ability to develop his potential, that way if we don't leave him a massive inheritance he can earn a living in a competitive world.
I had so many kids that I "raised" while in the Army, I felt that I only need one of my very own! :)
Many kids nowadays leave the nest without the skills to IMHO opinion survive in this world. I know that experience plays a big part, but the fundamental skills that a parent should impart is missing.
I say many because I've got a new kid on my team, 21 years old, who has the maturity and poise of someone much older and I see him going far. I meant his sister at a company event, and she too is very mature. They openly praise their parents as giving them the tools to make it far in life.
Vadim G.
IT Service Center Manager at McCombs School of Business
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I think the article proves that you really do not need to know anything to write for the magazines and you could just come up with stuff to be read.
1) All of the afluent families I know have 1 child, and very rarely - 2. Nobody has more than 2 - you either make money or kids.
2) The situation changes as the family has less and less - the poorer the family, the more kids they have. And it also works in reverse - the more kids you have, the more reseources you spend on them, the less you have to spend on other things for yourself. I know, I have 3. That is unless you are content on driving a Porsche, and having your kids dress at Walmart and go to YMCA for daycare and extracurricular activities.
3) Is this like the old joke:
- How old are your kids?
- 10,9,8,7,6,5 and then we decided to buy a TV for the bedroom
So even that doesn't support more kids=more money premise.
I do think though that families that have a lot of kids display their future wealth - wealth of memories, wealth of fun at dinner table, wealth of stories at Thanksgiving and Christmas get together, and wealth of grandkids.
:)
Misty K.
Business Development Consultant / Favorite Client Cloner
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Verne Harnish has concentrated pretty hard on life work balance in his newsletters and I think he has collected some great information from his readers that you might find relevant to this question. See Verne's blog article "False Msculinity" at http://verneharnish.typepad.com/ for information on a rite of passage program for his children.
Links:
Hey.. i never realised what a status symbol I had... or doesn't it count if you are the woman... suspect not... as if it was not always our choice.. i mean.. men don't really still believe they control this do they?
i have six... yes six children and since divorcing 8 years ago have done it largely on my own.. now only two at home.. a doddle. Was instumental in what i did when I returned to work.. had to do a sales job and have some control over correlation between effort and income. A s a man it may be seen as evidence of his prowess or income but as a woman it can all too often be defining. I am not the woman with six children.. but so much more.
now it is lovely. They are friends and companions and we are so much less demanding and palce so many less expectations. They can be what they want to be. ......... and when i am old and infirm.... no... doesn't work that way!!!
Clarification added September 6, 2007:
PS... My children and i enjoy a good life style, the older ones are all in work, graduates with positive futures... do i want a ferrari... well maybe.. would I want it instead of a child... NEVER
Jon B.
President at Circulation Service America, Inc. - CircServ
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I would mirror Curtis on "what am I doing with them now". I have two daughters of my own and a step-daughter. They are 15, 17, and (almost) 18 at this time.
I know in China, where the 1 child law has been in place since the early seventies, Having a second kid (as a city dweller) shows that you're making your lot in the private sector - like raising a fist and saying "the government can't take anything away from me".
Most of the BIG families I've known have not been particularly wealthy. Later, as all those kids grow up, there is usually a stronger support system and the kids are often quite successful. They can lean on each other as opposed to having the parents as the only support.
It's all about HOW they are raised more than anything. Work ethic, the importance of education, respect for others, intorverted/extroverted environment... All that nature/nurture stuff probably plays more of a role than number of siblings.
David B.
European Sales Director at Industrial Defender
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I have 3 children, (plus a very supportive wife who looks after them whist I am away a lot). One of our children has profound special needs.
Status symbols? I don’t think so!
Does it mean I have a life outside work? Yes.
Does it mean I have priorities, focus and values? I hope so.
Would I swap them for a debt free life and a Ferrari? No way.
What do wealth and power have to do with moral superiority???
I think that the idea of multiple kids being a status symbol or whatever really holds some weight. The more important aspect of children, or family for that matter, is more that at the end of days what is someone going to remember most? Their job - not really. Their Mercedes - no. They're going to think of their family and their kids - to me, that's the most important part of life. We all work to see our family be happy, successful and have whatever they need.
There is a common generational wish that the kids to better than the parents. I know I want my kids to do better (I have 2). I therefore say there is some validity, but I would not say it is the Ultimate status symbol though.
Bruno R.
e-payments specialist
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Hi Steven,
Hum, didn't read the article yet (will do) but in a first place, I'd say I don't agree. You may like to have a look at a free research paper titled “From Quantity to Quality of Life: r-K selection and human development”
by Pr. Francis Heylighen & Jan L. Bernheim.
Just do a search on the title, you'll find it.
If there's a phenomenum like what you describe, I'd rather say it's an Amercian "WASP" point of view.
My 2 cents...
- Bruno.
p.s. I have no kids and I'm currently single. It does help me to find a job more easily.
Joe W.
Owner Technical Ventures LLC,30,000 #10 Most Connected Worldwide
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I am a single father of three that make me keep my priorities in order I believe this make me stronger as a father and in the work space!
Never my intention, and I have four girls. My wife wanted three and we had an "accident". I imagine I can afford more children than the "average" person, but it is not for status.
I can also tell you how stressful multiple girls can be, especially when one is not present (currently the youngest is in the hospital). When you have three, two team up on one.
The only thing that having multiple kids "proves" is that your plumbing works and you chose to have unprotected sex. ;-)
I have three kids. I sure don't feel wealthy. Not after kissing my salary goodbye and watching it go into their 529 accounts and daycare, etc, etc. They also seem to want nothing more in life than to eat everything in sight and not stop growing. At least we never have to worry about the milk or bread going bad any more. :-)
Though I have to say, I am proud of them!. Perhaps that's where the "wealth" & "Status" comes into play for any father. They sure are great looking kids! Also, there's no better feeling for a dad than having people smile at you all and admire them while you've got all three in tow during a walk down the street.
Kurt W.
Consultant at KJW Consulting
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While I understand what the author is conveying, it think it is more of a status symbol among the Right-wing Christian demographic, and that as a general status symbol are those that had 1 or 2 early in their adult life, and now that they are about to be empty-nesters, go back and have a second small family of 1 or 2 children. It's their change to take advantage of the affluence they have attained and the lessons they learned over the previous 15 - 20+ years and this time have fun being a parent now that tye have completed the on the job training from the first set. Some of these second nuclear families are their own biological children; some are adopted, in many cases internationally. To all of those that are giving parent hood the second co around, Congratulations and Good luck!
Kevin C.
Call Center Quality Specialist
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If that is the case, then the couple that has 15 or 16 kids and their own reality show must be rolling in money.
I would have to disagree with the article. In the past, you had to have several to work the fields and the inevitable loss due to disease for some of them. But in the modern era, say 1960's onward (I'm thinking of the amount of cureable diseases), I would think its more of a religious or family tradition to have several.
I should mention that the status is considered void if they're not married. The reason becomes clear in a moment. A father with multiple children have these things going for him:
(1) He has a happy marriage, indicating a stable enough personality that some woman has been willing to carry and raise "his" children.
(2) He wants to do a good job in his work so that he can financially support his large family.
(3) Morally he's setting a good example for his children.
(4) Physically, God wants his lineage to continue.
(5) For purposes of a job interview, men with children are considered more stable and less likely to quit after a short time.
In the U.S., it's unusual to have multiple children for no other reason than the status symbol (I would expect that more in Japan), but that doesn't change perceptions.
