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Athar K

Registered Patent Attorney at McAndrews, Held & Malloy, Ltd.

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What advice would you offer to a CA Bar Examinee?

What advice would you offer to a CA Bar Examinee?

I will be taking the July 2008 bar in California. I am interested in hearing your thoughts regarding what worked for you when you took the bar, and what you might have done differently. If you would rather not share your experiences publicly, please feel free to email me directly at atharkhan[at]gmail[dot]com.

Thank you in advance for your guidance.

-Athar.

posted February 14, 2008 in Intellectual Property, Career Management | Closed

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Ron B

Vice President & Deputy General Counsel at Yahoo! Inc.

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This was selected as Best Answer

1) Practice, practice, practice. Particularly for the performance exams, it makes good sense to take timed practice tests of your own in which you actually outline and write out answers under deadline pressure.

2) Focus hard on the multistate topics since these provide the most return for your time investment. These topics are both essay exam topics and on the multistate multiple choice exam.

3) Bring extra pencils and pens to the exam. I guarantee that one or more of them will break or stop working during the three days you are there.

4) Just before the exam starts, set your watch for 12:00. That way, you can easily see how much time you have left in the current testing session.

5) Get a hotel room at or within walking distance of the venue. You don't need the stress of being caught in unexpected traffic or looking for a parking space on the day of the exam.

6) At least when I took the exam, there was no special penalty for a wrong answer on the multistate so if you don't know the answer, make an educated guess and move on. You don't want to leave half the exam unfinished while you ponder a tough question. Chance are, if it's tough for you, it's tough for others.

7) Study hard and be relentless about focusing on areas of weakness. If you are an ace at real property but can't do torts questions, focus more on torts. This takes discipline because it is much more rewarding to see yourself getting things right than getting things wrong during your practice sessions, but it will help you a lot more on test day.

8) Consider taking a reputable bar prep course if you can afford one. The focus of taking regular classes and having the extensive practice materials will alone help many applicants.

Good luck!

posted February 14, 2008

 

Cathy C

Attorney, Mediator, & Conflict Management Consultant

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Do your prep and then RELAX once you get there. Someone told me that about 85% of the people taking the exam have the requisite knowledge while only about 50% pass and the difference between the figures is related to how you deal with stress. Waaayyyy back when I took the Bar Exam, they had a five or ten minute warning period before the end of the section. After the warning was sounded, you weren't allowed to leave if you finished early. I made a point of finishing in time to leave before that warning because the stress in the room rose to a palpable level that last few minutes. I needed to get my mind ready for the next section and watching people that were going to fail stress out was not conducive to that goal. Have faith in yourself. That's good advice for most things in life. Warm wishes for success! - Cathy

posted February 14, 2008

 

Krista H

Senior Associate at Pillsbury Winthrop Shaw Pittman

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Take the very best bar review course you can afford. This is worth an additional loan if necessary in my mind. It makes no sense to get as far as you have gotten only to blow the bar exam. I went with Bar-Bri. I'm sure there are other reputable courses that are fine too. Pick one and go with it.

You will reach a point during the course in which you won't want to do what they have told you to do. You'll tell yourself that you already know how to do that. You'll think that something in your background or experience gives you better insight into the minds and motives of the bar examiners. You'll tell yourself that the answers the bar review folks want you to provide don't make sense or are contrary to what you learned in law school. Thank yourself for sharing and then DO IT THEIR WAY ANYWAY! This is not law school or the practice of law. This is no time for critical thinking. This is no time for self-expression or creative flair. Do whatever you have to do to restrain the artist in you for those two days. You will finish. You will pass. You will be happy. I promise.

Another thing -- I wouldn't rely on others' note taking or issue spotting skills. Study buddies are fine, but they won't be able to help you during the test.

Finally, seek tutoring early and often if you find that you are having any difficulty with the exercises.

Good luck!

posted February 14, 2008

 

Thomas R

Partner at LeClairRyan

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Run. Ok, I'm kidding. The advice given above is sound. Practice is really the key to taking any bar exam. The better bar review courses will give you practice exams as well as hints on ways to eke out a few extra points in some situations. For example, credit is given for issue spotting. If you're nearly out of time on an essay, outline the issues that you recognize with potential resolutions rather than leaving the page blank or offering a partial answer that is written out in full verse.

A final piece of advice. Do NOT cram all night the night before. The brain is a tool like any other, and it requires fairly constant maintenance. That means sleep. Try to get a full night's sleep the night before, however your body would normally define it. If you normally get 7 hours, try to do 7 yours. If you normally get 5 hours but are not alert, extend it. You get the idea. Believe in yourself, and you'll likely do fine.

posted February 14, 2008

 

John N

Owner, Law Offices of John Nowakowski

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I highly recommend PMBR for preparation with the MBE. BAR/BRI is fine too, but I would probably take PMBR if only given one choice. CA expects someone to do extremely well on the MBE. Also, if you are well prepared for the MBE it translates over to the essays, because usually 3 essays are multi-state topics (plus you know PR will be on there). BAR/BRI MBE prep is nothing compared to PMBR.

posted February 14, 2008

 

Kumar M

Patent Attorney

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Best Answers in: Intellectual Property (2)

A fellow friend shared the following advice with me, and it helped me pass the first time.

Rule #1 Do EVERYTHING Bar Bri tells you to do. I know it seems like a lot, but STICK TO THE PLAN. They know what they are doing. I really took that to heart. Even when it might seem like overkill and even when its a subject you feel that you are strong in (hypothetical exp: I think I am very strong in Evidence so I can slack off on my essays.. WRONG! Don't do that.) Sometimes subjects you are strong in law school, you will find you are terrible at in Bar prep.
Rule #2 WRITE LOTS OF ESSAYS AND PT'S!! Ultimately the bar is 2/3s writing. You will not be studying smart if you spend a majority of your time on MBE's and neglect your writing. Seriously...write out essays. I did this and when it came time for the bar I felt ready because I knew that I had written essay, after essay after essay.
Regarding "review of the law." I know this is boring. Just reading a Bar Bri outline was not effective for me...So I would "skim" the outline and then write out notecards or print notecards. In law school, my best study method was to write out note cards. Then, I would read them to myself and quiz myself. You know how you study best. Use it! Whether it's writing out outlines on the board in a room, or note cards or creating your own outline in Word, use whatever works for YOU.
Don't get discouraged if your scores are low. Your scores will be low in the beginning. As you keep reviewing, writing out essays, doing MBE's your scores will go up.
OK. You probably won't believe me but I LITERALLY did about 80% of the PMBR books! I know there are around 3,000 MBE's or so but try to do as many as you can. Some people do 50 a day. I found that doing ALL of my bar -bri assignments and 50 MBE's a day was too much. So I did between 25-50 a day. As the bar got closer, I actually increased my MBE's because that is the area I struggled most with. ALSO, READ THE REVIEW OF THE MBE ANSWERS!
To simply do MBE's and then check your score is not effective. You need to learn WHY you are getting the wrong answers wrong and why you are getting the right answers right.
Remember, YOU CAN'T MEMORIZE EVERYTHING! Seriously, that's the truth. It's just too much law. Don't kill yourself over trying to know and understand every little nuance of the law. Focus on the Bar-Bri lectures. They really know what is tested on the bar over and over again. Make a star, highlight, etc. the areas of the law that the bar commonly tests.
Well...I could go on and on but I'll let you go now. You've got LOTS of work to do
(PS: One more thing. They say when you are studying for the bar you will eventually "hit a wall." This is absolutely true. You will start strong and excited. By the end of June, early July you will start feeling burnt out and unmotivated. This is normal...Hang in there and remember STICK TO YOUR BAR BRI OUTLINE. Remember rule #1 DO EVERYTHING BAR BRI TELLS YOU)

posted February 14, 2008

 

Jason B

Attorney at Howrey LLP

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1) First of all, take Bar/Bri. I know it costs $3000+, but they do a good job. Listen to what they tell you. Do it their way. Don't be creative, be a sheep. Sheep pass the test.

2) When it comes to the PT's and the essays, its all about format: Short and sweet with lots of headings. Almost all essays can and should be addressed as folows: The issue is ___. The law is ___. Here, ___(apply law to facts). Therefore _____ (conclusion).

3) Stay at a hotel within walking distance of the exam, if at all possible.

4) Type the exam if you type faster than you write, or if you have bad handwriting.

5) Focus on learning to write essays and PT's. The multiple choice is important, but you will reach a point of diminishing returns, where additional weeks of practice would do little to boost your score.

6) Maintain a positive attitude. When you walk in there, believe that you've seen it all and nothing can shock you. You will be shocked anyway, but just laugh and do your best. You don't have to ace the test, only pass it.


Good luck and best wishes!

posted February 14, 2008

 

Warren N

Product Development Attorney, McAfee, Inc

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1) If you have the PMBR, practice as many of the questions as possible. Start now, if you can. 100 questions a night.

2) If you're using Bar/Bri, make sure you read the model answers for past exams. It will give you a feel for the format and key elements to provide in all of your answers, but especially for those questions that are not tested as often (e.g. secured trans)

3) answers to essay questions are essentially a memory dump. write everything you can think of, keep your writing as legible as possible, and don't spend time correcting minor typos or spelling errors.

And Good Luck!

posted February 14, 2008

 

Jonathan E

Associate Attorney at Robert Smylie & Associates

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Here's some helpful advice: Don't take advice from anybody unless you're paying for it.

Having said that, I took the exam in Ontario in summer 2001. Every morning in the months before the exam, I would go to gym and lift weights, and would review flashcards in between sets. I stayed at a hotel (Red Roof Inn). I was woken up each morning at about 3:00 a.m. from a train that rode by outside my room. I bought a bunch of sandwiches before the exams started, kept them in the fridge at the hotel and that was my lunch each day. The restaurants in the area will be packed at lunchtime. I saw a movie the evening before the first exam day. I had two friends in the area with whom I hung out with in the evenings, and we made a pact to not discuss the exam. I passed (one and done).

In response to some of the postings, heed the advice that more is not necessarily better. I disagree that your focus should be more on the multi-state because these topics are covered in the MBE and essay portions. You have to know the law. If you don't know the law, you won't pass. And frankly, if you don't know the law, you shouldn't pass because every lawyer should at least know the law. So: know the law. After that, it is all about preparation for getting the right answer. When it comes to that, you do not need the "A student" answer. All you need to do is enough to pass. Also, being great on essays will not compensate for being not-so-great on the MBE. Therefore, you need to be "just good enough" on all three portions (MBE, essays and performance).

At this point in time, you really shouldn't be taking practice exams. Your focus should be on the law (outlines, flashcards, whatever). Nail that down now. When your classes are over (around May?), then you should be going into exam-practice mode.

Good luck.

posted February 15, 2008

 

Jason S

Business, employment, and technology attorney

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General advice: I used a rather macabre reminder that at any given moment I or someone else I love could die. Strange and twisted - yes. But it had the effect of first putting things in perspective. With that perspective, I moved relied on an old military maxim of something to the effect of "more sweat in training means less blood in battle" i.e., study, practice, and repeat.

Some specific thoughts: Do the bar prep, both the multistate (PMBR) and the Bar-Bri. In studying, get a routine and stick with it. I used a 3 hour session followed by a run, lunch and another 3 hour study session. At the end of the night, I took at least a multistate test and did one essay. Definitely focus hard on the multistate. Actually simulate exam settings, e.g., uncomfortable chair, time, and WRITE out your written exam answers. I'm not sure if the California bar has the added day where you are given a "legal assignment" and asked to write a memo to a senior partner/legal pleading. If so, make sure your bar prep classes cover this. Not to disparage other practitioners, but aside from Mr. Bob Dylan, I don't think there are many naturally gifted writers that you would want to rely on for advice preparing for the written portion of the Bar Exam.

Get a hotel room (even if it is cheap) that is nearby, map out the directions, and maybe even follow the route.Make sure you get a great meal (you deserve it at this point) and resist the temptation to study past 10:00 (no scientific basis for this time, but it just worked for me). In the morning, stretch 10-15 minutes (corny, maybe, but it feels so good). I would get something to eat but not a full fledged breakfast, juice, granola/oatmeal, and coffee.

Good luck.

posted February 15, 2008

 

Joseph C. G

Partner at DLA Piper

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Probably the only solid piece of advice I haven't seen mentioned above is that you strongly should resist the temptation to chat with your friends and colleagues during lunch about what they think the "right" answers were on the previous sections. Wait until the ENTIRE bar exam is over (after day 2 or 3) to chat about it, if you want to at all.

Walk away when they bring it up during lunch or in between days. It will only risk demoralizing you and destabilizing your confidence. All test-takers inevitably start second guessing themselves before the exam is totally over, and you can't change anything anyway, so why talk about it?

Good luck!

posted February 15, 2008

 

Chas R

General Counsel and VP of Product Development

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A lot of great suggestions. The one additional tactic I used was to "use all the facts." The bar test questions are written so precisely, that there are very few facts that can't be used in some way. You might want to circle or mark the facts in the question (dates, times, descriptions, prices, etc.), and then as you formulate and outline your answer, put some sort of "check" to indicate you used that fact. If a few unchecked facts remain, take a little time to think of other legal principles that may turn on those facts and add them to your outline.

One other piece of advice is - if you MUST worry about this, then start worrying AFTER your 3rd year finals. That's the time to really kick the panic in gear! :-)

posted February 15, 2008

 

Richard C

Lawyer, Arbitrator, & Mediator at Hoff, Curtis, Pacht, Cassidy, & Frame, P. C.

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I spent 14 years as a member of my state’s Board of Bar Exams (11 as Chair). California has its own system and I understand it is a bit unique.

But, as a long time reader of essay answers to bar exam questions, let me offer advice that I think will apply anywhere with an essay exam: Address and answer the question that was asked, not some other question.

Nothing aggravated me more as a reader than extraneous information included to show that, even if the examinee did not know the answer to my question, he or she knows something.

That strategy never helped anyone with me. If the information did not relate to the question, I added no credit for it. But if it was wrong, or if by trying to relate the unrelated, it suggested that the examinee did not understand the question, I would subtract credit from credit that was otherwise earned.

Study hard. Read the question. Answer it. You should do fine. Good Luck

posted February 15, 2008

 

Joe S

Attorney/Mediator at Tenax Law Group

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The essays are all about issue spotting. As you practice, take note which issues cluster together - this will lower the chances of missing them on the exam. E.g. Line up? Fourth, fifth, sixth amendments and due process all cluster here. One of them is always not applicable, I forget which, but you get credit for mentioning the issue anyway. You will not get penalized for spotting issues that are not there.

Stay nimble. The reason so few pass after so many study so hard is because examinees rarely prepare correctly, i.e., by taking timed examinations. With 15 mins. to outline and 8 to 10 issues, you get about 5 minutes per issue. So hit each issue succinctly with two of three sentences and move on. If you identify all the issues and apply the facts to them, you will pass, regardless of whether your final resolution was correct on the issue.

Finally: Do not try to distinguish yourself with a lengthy discussion about the finer points of the law. Do so and you will likely fail, because while you are stating the extra-contractual trends in modern contract law for 15 minutes, you lost time for at least 2 or 3 issues. The model answer is moronic: "A contract is a legally binding agreement between two parties. To form a contract you need mutual assent. When Bob made and offer to Sally it was a contract because there was a meeting of the minds." No great revelations here, but without the basics, you will fail.

Clarification added February 16, 2008:

Last thing: expect to see something unexpected. Be cool. You expected something unexpected. When this happens, just make up a rule of law for it and apply it. If you apply the law (that you just made up) to the facts, you will get credit for it.

posted February 16, 2008

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Jeanetha B

PRACTICE REVIEWER at IRBA

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Draft as many pleadings as you can and discuss it with various seniors to get their inputs - this will increas your confidence in drafting your pleadings as well as assist you with your strategic approach.
good luck!

posted February 15, 2008